Let’s see like this

An unqualified person has been selected

Now adiyen was asked to probe it and prove that the person is not fit for the job

adiyen thought if that person looses the job he and his family will suffer

So adiyen made some how to continue in his work

So adiyen thinks that adiyen have saved a family – positive KARMA

Suddenly after few months that person lost his body because of an accident in the office

Now adiyen think because of me he died – negative KARMA

But in reality adiyen is not the doer, adiyen is instrumental so there is nothing like WRONG DOING or GOOD DOING.

THERE IS ONLY DOING SO NO KARMA

what ever one does is already done one is just doing

Arjuna Duryothana are just doers nobody is good and nobody is bad from Reality point of view

So just do what you have to do and be as you are

That is what Bhagwan Krishna says by telling stick to your Varna ashram dharmam

don’t try to imitate some body else
Be who you are

So if one is an instrument of Sri Krishna
There is nothing to think, decide , act or even ask for

If one thinks that HE IS THE DOER THEN THAT IS BLASPHEMY

Let Sri Krishna decide and act

There is no point in asking for anything even Sri Vaikundam

Let Sri Krishna sends one wherever SRI KRISHNA likes – may be hell or haeven or Sri Vaikundam or let Sri Krishna push one out of Sri Vaikundam after allowing inside
What is going to happen

But one thing is sure and obvious Sri Krishna is always with his instrument wherever he sends his instrument he is always with that

What more is needed

So wherever one goes Sri Krishna is always there
What ever one does is done by BHAGWAN SRI KRISHNA

Understanding this is liberation
So there is no question of good or bad doing

adiyen

But in reality adiyen is not the doer, adiyen is instrumental so there is nothing like WRONG DOING or GOOD DOING.
THERE IS ONLY DOING SO NO KARMAFrom MADAN

What ever one does is done by BHAGWAN SRI KRISHNA
Understanding this is liberation So there is no question of good or bad doingFrom MADAN

Madan swamy, if everything is done by Krishna, then why does he make us face the punya and paapam reaction?

Is it because Krishna is whimsically doing things and shifting the blame on us?

Please respond and I’ll continue the discussion

adiyen.

kambandasan Swamy
Namaskaram

Swamy punya and paapam is only for one who thinks he is the doer not for the surrendered who is no more a doer

Similarly if one thinks he is the doer he himself blames him or others due to that ignorance

If he is not the doer upon whom can SRI KRISHNA shift the blame

Swamy please continue

I am glad to see this understanding. For a surrendered person there is no more karmic reaction; he is not the doer; everything rests upon Krishna. True.

But by definition, a surrender person does only those things that is prescribed by Krishna (or acharyan). So, a surrender person is always following dharma. 

There are indeed two things – dharma and adharma; good and bad. A surrendered person consciously does only the dharmic activities, because that is what is pleasing to his master.

Therefore it is absurd to say:

Arjuna Duryothana are just doers nobody is good and nobody is bad from Reality point of viewFrom MADAN

because, Duryodhana had done so many adharmic things against the dharmic Pandavas. Arjuna had always consciously considered what is dharma and struck to it. At the beginning of the war also, he carefully considered what is dharma; when he could not resolve it he placed the matter in front of Krishna. (see Chapter 2, sloka 7 – “dharma sammooda cethaaha“).

Krishna instructs Arjuna (and us) what is dharma and what is adharma, what are the consequence of following each, and how to choose dharma always. The best dharma is to always act in a manner of surrender to Krishna. In Arjuna’s case, Krishna ordered Arjuna to fight, and therefore that is the best dharma. In our case, we have to do what our acharyan has indicated and that in dharma. In professional life situations, we have to considered based on what the acharyan has instructed and do accordingly. that is dharma.

So, please don’t bring forward statements like “that there is nothing good or bad, dharma or adharma”. Such improper understanding comes from previous exposure to mayavadam philosophy. In your previous post also the this understanding is evident (“everything is illusion; nothing is true”). Ramanujacharya has clearly brought out the fallacies of this and other such philosophies, and established Ramanuja-dharshanam authoritatively. His successors have been preserving those teachings and giving us up to this day. We simply have to repeat what they are giving us. Instead, if we bring back the already dismantled philosophies into this forum, that will confuse the ignorant public accessing this forum.  I beg you, please refrain from doing so. Dhanyosmi with all my heart.

adiyen dasan.

Namaskaram Swamy

Devareer your self told that ” he is not the doer” then how he can consciously do to please his master

If one is surrendered who is there to do

Dharma and adharma are not “THINGS”
and it cannot be synonymous with GOOD and BAD

DHARMA really is one’s innate nature or primal nature

ADHARMA really is alien nature , the nature other than one’s own

DHARMA is ETERNAL

It doesn’t mean good and bad
Kurukshetra war is DHARMA YUDDHA
that is Religious or righteous war

It is not war between good and bad

What Arjuna did was adharma by trying to become a sage than to be shatriya that doesn’t mean it is bad

And Duryothana did Dharma by fighting and dying in war instead of running even though he knows that he will be defeated that doesn’t mean it is good

Dharma cannot be defined – it is one’s true nature or being as one’s true nature

Adharma is being as alien nature

It is very superficial to see Dharma and adharma as good and bad

DEVARAREER TOLD

“Such improper understanding comes from previous exposure to mayavadam philosophy”

HOW ONE CAN TELL ONE’S UNDERSTANDING IS IMPROPER – THAT TO ASSUMING IT AS DUE TO EXPOSURE TO SOME PHILOSOPHY

WHO HAS THE PROPER UNDERSTANDING OF PHILOSOPHY

WILL ACHARYA ACCEPT IF A SISHYA TELLS THAT ONE OF HIS SISHYA HAS IMPROPER UNDERSTANDING

IS THIS THE TRUE NATURE

this is the first time adiyen hearing that word mayavadam – what is that

Next

“will confuse the ignorant public accessing this forum”

How can one use the word “IGNORANT PUBLIC”

and HOW ONE CAN TELL PUBLIC IS IGNORANT AND IT WILL CONFUSE OTHERS

WHY THIS KIND OF GENERALISATION

WHO IS COMPLETE IN KNOWLEDGE

NO ACHARYA WILL ACCEPT THESE WORDS

FINALLY
Devarareer told

“I beg you, please refrain from doing so”

What is the meaning of ” I ” in the above Devareer statement

IS THIS RAMANUJA DHARISINAM

shamikkanum Swamy

adiyen

Okay, please take your time to reflect on the message conveyed and understand the essence. If there is any indication of initiating a debate from my side, please ignore that; my intention is not to engage in any debate. The message is important and therefore I expressed it.

Thank you.

adiyen.

Namaskaram Swamy

adiyen will

Devareer shamithu arulavendun

Suthama puriyala Swamy

Puriyalaya?.

I listened to an Enpani audio long back. That was the reply to a query asking for prayachittam by a person who got the job fraudulently. He got the job many years back. He also mentioned that presently it will be difficult to give up the job as prayachittam.

Sri Velukkudi Krishnan swamy mentioned that most appropriate prayachittam would be to accept his act with the concerned one, give up the job and further given some suggestions. If giving up the job is the prayachittam, then helping him to continue the job will be advisable?.

Srimathe Rangaramanuja Mahadesikaya Namaha
Srimathe Sri Varaha Mahadesikaya Namaha
Sri Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy Thiruvadigaley Sharanam
Sri:

Vittaldas Maharaj upanyAsam:
Kalyanam nadakkanumna andha poi thappu illa
Velai kidaichu oru family save agum na andha poi thappu illa

Poi in general thappu we all know.
Valluvar says lie can be good if result is good

According to Velukkudi Krishnan Swamy upanyAsam

A pig 🐖 ran into a Rishi’s house. A hunter came. Asked Rishi where is pig?

For Rishi, pointing Pig = Ending life of pig
For hunter , not pointing Pig = against hunger of hunter
So Rishi said
“That which can see, cannot talk” = Eyes
“That which can talk cannot see” = Mouth

Here in this case, it is a case of a Judge’s role.

3 rounds interview to understand the genuinely of candidate.

First two rounds this option applied:
dharmam2: giving pink slip to a genuinely good honest, skilled employee.

Till that time benefit of doubt applied. What if he was really Genuine & management was mistaken?

There can be some other family issues making the employee underperform. Who knows?

Only 3rd round he was caught red handed.

So, once truth uncovers itself things are clear.

My opinion “If at all we must try to get job for someone not lose, if external candidate outside org it’s fine, this question wont even arise, if already recruited to the organization then many levels of interview might have already been undergone/undeewent”

So management is “muttal thanam” I believe.

How can one person chest everyone? I know only politicians do that 😂

Dasanudasan

*Candidate= To read employee
*Chest= To read Cheat
*undeewent= To read underwent

Also, skill is a subjective parameter.
Ellarukkum ellam theriyanumnu avasiyam kidaiyadhu

Adiyen know an employee who was considered “Waste” in X org doing well in senior post in another Y org.

It differs from company to company

If Mgt had told the interviewer check if candidate is genuine the process itself would have been different.

But management for some reason “Lied” to interviewer initially that this is just a “Project interview” which means internal recruitment to a particular task.

So Mgt full Truth sollala. Onnu (fraud) employee ya nambanum. Illa Interviewer a nambanum. Naduvula game Adina ippadi dhan.

Interviewer enna scape goata? They don’t know even for mahabhali a sukrAchArya is there to save.

Adiyen don’t know what point I am making.
So apologies in advance

Dasanudasan

Namaskaram Vikraminside Swamy

Swami there are infinite possibilities of the situation Devareer told

But one cannot know all the infinite possibilities

Only free will knows all the infinite possibilities

So everything has already happened
One is doing what is already done

If one is doing what is already done
he cannot be the doer
What is the point in analysing the outcome
and blame game in one’s own perspective as being the doer

adiyen

Namaskaram Vikraminside Swamy

adiyen just now remembered
There is a movie called Vinodhaya sitham

In that movie there was a similar situation as Devareer told

adiyen is not endorsing anything by suggesting Devareer to watch that movie

Thought it might through some light over Devareer’s question

And moreover it is holiday today there is time to watch

adiyen

Namaskaram kambandasan Swamy

adiyen realised what Devareer is trying to mean after thinking for a while

There is no match for Devarareer in terms of explaining using scriptures teachings and methodology

adiyen knows nothing about that

But one thing is sure both Devareer and adiyen are telling the same thing that is TO SURRENDER TO BHAGWAN SRI KRISHNA

Lets do the same thing

Devareer asirvathukku prarthikren

Blessed to discuss with Devareer

adiyen

Madan swamy, namaskarams to you. Thank you for your kind understanding.

I am fully convinced right from that beginning that you are very much attached to (your) acharya, and that is the foremost quality to be appreciated.

My only concern is that to my limited intelligence it appears that your grasp of our philosophy is mixed with interpretations from other schools of thought. The fallacies of these schools of philosophy have been clearly pointed out by Ramanujacharya and his teachings have been preserved by our acharyas. So, it is important for us to hear from our acharyas and base all our discussions on these fundamental teachings. If we have not heard something from our acharyas, it is better not to express opinion based on our learnings from other sources.

Please continue to regularly and systematically hear from our Velukkudi swamy. Over time the fundamentals will be very clear. I would particularly suggest our swamy’s upanyasams on Dhatti pancakam; Dhatti Pancakam is a set of five verses which glorifies how Ramanujacharya exposed the incompleteness of the 16 different schools of philosophy and established Vishista advaitam as the wholesome, complete, practical philosophy. In our swamy’s upanyasam, he briefly explains what these incomplete philosophies are and how Bhasyakaarar dismantled them. (one of these is the mayavatham philosophy). 

adiyen dasan.

PS: if you see any tiny bit of positive aspect in me, it is only because of my acharyas anugraham. 

Namaskaram kambandasan Swamy

Thank you very much Swamy for Devareer’s suggestions

It is of immense value to adiyen

adiyen

adiyen.

Dhanyosmi Kambandasan Swami
🙏

For reference:

Dhatee Panchakam – தா⁴டீ பஞ்சகம்

பாது³கே யதிராஜஸ்ய கத²யந்தி யதா³க்²யயா | 
தஸ்ய தா³ஶரதே²꞉ பாதௌ³ ஶிரஸா தா⁴ரயாம்யஹம் || 
பாஷண்ட³த்³ருமஷண்ட³தா³வத³ஹனஶ்சார்வாகஶைலாஶனி꞉ பௌ³த்³த⁴த்⁴வாந்தனிராஸவாஸரபதிர்ஜைனேப⁴கண்டீ²ரவ꞉ | 
மாயாவாதி³ பு⁴ஜங்க³ப⁴ங்க³க³ருட³ஸ்த்ரைவித்³ய சூடா³மணி꞉
ஶ்ரீரங்கே³ஶஜயத்⁴வஜோ விஜயதே ராமானுஜோ(அ)யம் முனி꞉ || 1 || 

பாஷண்ட³ ஷண்ட³கி³ரிக²ண்ட³னவஜ்ரத³ண்டா³꞉
ப்ரச்ச²ன்னபௌ³த்³த⁴மகராலயமந்த²த³ண்டா³꞉ |
வேதா³ந்தஸாரஸுக²த³ர்ஶனதீ³பத³ண்டா³꞉ 
ராமானுஜஸ்ய விலஸந்திமுனேஸ்த்ரித³ண்டா³꞉ || 2 || 

சாரித்ரோத்³தா⁴ரத³ண்ட³ம் சதுரனயபதா²லங்க்ரியாகேதுத³ண்ட³ம்
ஸத்³வித்³யாதீ³பத³ண்ட³ம் ஸகலகலிகதா²ஸம்ஹ்ருதே꞉ காலத³ண்ட³ம் |
த்ரய்யந்தாலம்ப³த³ண்ட³ம் த்ரிபு⁴வனவிஜயச்ச²த்ரஸௌவர்ணத³ண்ட³ம்
த⁴த்தேராமானுஜார்ய꞉ ப்ரதிகத²கஶிரோ வஜ்ரத³ண்ட³ம் த்ரித³ண்ட³ம் || 3 || 

த்ரய்யா மாங்க³ள்யஸூத்ரம் த்ரிதா²யுக³பயுக³ரோஹணாலம்ப³ஸூத்ரம்
ஸத்³வித்³யாதீ³பஸூத்ரம் ஸகு³ணனயவிதா³ம் ஸம்ப³தா³ம்ஹாரஸூத்ரம் |
ப்ரஜ்ஞாஸூத்ரம் பு³தா⁴னாம் ப்ரஶமத⁴னமன꞉ பத்³மினீனாலஸூத்ரம்
ரக்ஷாஸூத்ரம் முனீனாம் ஜயதி யதிபதேர்வக்ஷஸி ப்³ரஹ்மஸூத்ரம் || 4 ||

பாஷண்ட³ஸாக³ரமஹாப³ட³பா³முகா²க்³னி꞉
ஶ்ரீரங்க³ராஜசரணாம்பு³ஜமூலதா³ஸ꞉ |
ஶ்ரீவிஷ்ணுலோகமணி மண்ட³பமார்க³தா³யீ
ராமானுஜோ விஜயதே யதிராஜராஜ꞉ || 5 ||

************
https://velukkudi.tv/stream/dhatee-panchakam/ 

100% true swamy. To actually understand the complete explanation on how Vishishtaadvaitam is superior to all other (incomplete) philosophies, we have to systematically (hear and) study SriBhasyam. Dhaatti pancakam is a tribute to Ramanujacharya glorifying his accomplishments.

In his upanyasam on Dhaatti pancakam our Velukkudi Swamy briefly mentions the different schools of thought and why they are incomplete. This series is a ‘quick reckoner’; however if one has the required time it is better to go through our Swamy’s upanyasam on SriBhasyam and study the scripture.

It is to highlight the connection to SriBhasyam I had referred to Ramanujacharya as ‘Bhasyakaarar’ in this context above (“…what these incomplete philosophies are and how Bhasyakaarar dismantled them“).

adiyen dasan.

Your point is well taken swamy.

I just intervened between your discussion for the following reason and to avoid any possible misunderstanding by the reader.

One can not expect others to refer to the upanyasam of sri. Velukkudi Krishnan swamy only. They are at their liberty to check with any author’s vyakyanam or other’s upanyasams also. If it happens, he may feel that Dhati panchakam speaks of the victory of Ramanujam over other philosophies only and not on the details you have indicated about Dhati panchakam. There is a chance for one to feel that he is not given correct information.

Generally, Bhasyakaarar refers to Ramanujam only and not to his work. Hence, anyone who reads your reference to Bhasyakaarar in your post, will take it as Ramanujam only.

P.S : I take this opportunity to indicate that I purchased upanyasam on SriBhashyam by sri. Velukkudi Krishnan swamy. It contains upanyasam on first two chapters only. I did not inform kinchitkaram office, since I am not sure about the availability of upanyasam on other two chapters.

adiyen

adiyen. 🙂

Swamy, I think it is better to speak to KKT representative and get it sorted out. If only first two chapters are available that is okay. But if the rest of the chapters are left out because of something like packaging error, it is better to sort it out sooner than later.

adiyen. 

Thank you, swamy. I have been thinking of sending mail, but did not send. The main reason is, my point of interest are covered in the first two chapters. 

I will send a mail.

100% true swamy. To actually understand the complete explanation on how Vishishtaadvaitam is superior to all other (incomplete) philosophies, we have to systematically (hear and) study SriBhasyam. Dhaatti pancakam is a tribute to Ramanujacharya glorifying his accomplishments.

In his upanyasam on Dhaatti pancakam our Velukkudi Swamy briefly mentions the different schools of thought and why they are incomplete. This series is a ‘quick reckoner’; however if one has the required time it is better to go through our Swamy’s upanyasam on SriBhasyam and study the scripture.

It is to highlight the connection to SriBhasyam I had referred to Ramanujacharya as ‘Bhasyakaarar’ in this context above (“…what these incomplete philosophies are and how Bhasyakaarar dismantled them“).

adiyen dasan.

 

From கம்பன்தாசன்

Swami where can adiyen get our Swami’s upanyasam on Sri Bashyam? 

P.S : I take this opportunity to indicate that I purchased upanyasam on SriBhashyam by sri. Velukkudi Krishnan swamy..From SriVaishnava dasan

Badri Swamy, SriVaishnava swamy is the right person to answer this question.

adiyen.