In En PaNi 717 adiyen listened, some stories from purAna not being shared based on its intensity.
Most of times we don’t know uttara ramayana or Mahabharatham.
My poorvAcharyan Sri Thirukkudanthai Andavan has said not to leave out anything when preaching. Swamy illustrated like this in Acharya Ramamrutham: A North Indian Guru kept telling supremacy of lord Krishna. His shisyas when coming to parthasarathy Swamy temple Chennai found otherwise Krishna’s down to earth personality.
It’s often the reverse, south knows lesser of Ramayana and Mahabharatham (in my view). It’s easy for them (north) as they read complete Bhagavath Gita and so on.
We listen/read only selectively. When someone counters a story from purAna we are left with no choice than to be dumbstruck.
Question, can we filter sampradhayam and say selective truths/facts?
Won’t we be left behind? The moment when we say “Only relevant will be shared” implies that author knows that story. If it’s intense then how come we came to know it in first place? Who would have taught us? How we read it or learned it?
Swami’s EnpaNi #717 statements as quoted in the above thread is also detailed in past EnpaNi #552 “Clarification from My Side” in few categories as Swami says:
Category 1: Before asking a question, First search/look into Enpani audios &/or in Dharma Sandeha section for answers. Kandippa Bhadhil kidaichidum.
Category 2: If any specific questions related to your family customs/issues, you should ask to your own Acharyar/Vaadhiyar Swami. I will inform separately to their email only or sometimes I will not even tell.
Category 3: This is more of a common forum. Only common subjects will be addressed here related to Sanatana Dharmam,
Category 4: Any Special questions will be available in “Kalakshepam” for interested audiences. The depth spiritual knowledge in Granthams/books that needs to be acquired in few months dedicatedly from Kalakshepam, if asked in Enpani, then adiyen would not have answered it. Those knowledge needs to be learned from Acharyar by dedicating ourselves and learn from Him with obeisance. Suddenly if depth level doubts are raised in Enpani, it is difficult to explain properly in short audio clips. So, we can go and ask there in Kalashepam.
Category 5: .A knowledge that needs to be acquired by learning/listening for a long time by dedicating ourselves in Kalakshepam cannot be understood in 5 minutes. There are 75,000 people listening to Enpani audios, so any high level depth spiritual questions asked may be well known to the questioner, but if such high level questions are asked repeatedly in Enpani and answered continuously, then the other people “beginners of spiritual path” will be left behind, since they will not understand anything who are expecting the fundamentals. So the beginners will leave the forum as they will not understand what is being discussed and answered. So, I will not answer such “Special in-depth” questions in forum, but will be available in Kalakshepam and interested persons can attend there.
So, based on such above Categories only, I wouldn’t have answered. So, please no one to mistake me as I have not answered some questions. Ofcourse, all common questions and some depth knowledge will be answered in short audio clips. So, I would request everyone to keep this in mind.
From Swami’s Enpani “552” categorical platforms, adiyen think, the initial question asked in this thread “My poorvAcharyan Sri Thirukkudanthai Andavan has said not to leave out anything when preaching” falls in Category 4 question (Same as Swami’s answer with PoorvaAcharyar anugraham). Hence in Kalakshepam definite answer is always available for any in-depth specific questions like breakdown meanings of each word in Paasurams or Rahasya arthangal etc….. So we can approach Acharyan Swami/Velukkudi Swami and learn from them with obeisance. Those answers will not be provided in common forum as per category 3 & 5.
Swami’s Enpani 717 as quoted in this thread above “ippo….” is to consider the sensitivity of the subject, though true in puranad/Ithihasams cannot be told. Like in Mahabharatam, there are stories that cannot be told in places where the audience age level varies as well as maturity level varies. Hope it is understood. Only Stories that improves our Athma Gyanam for BhagavAt Kankaryam will help us.
Adiyen noticed that there is a typo error while explaining the question to Swami as “Dhanyosmi Swamin,@7:47”.
“Swamin” is used to address those who are younger to us by age or by Spiritual knowledge.
‘Swami’ is used for Elder by age as well as for POORNAN by Knowledge, which very well suits for Sri Velukkudi Swami, since each word we know is from Swami’s spiritual discourses.
ஒருவர் உறங்கலாம், இருவர் அமரலாம், மூவர் நிற்கலாம் – when mudal aazhvaars met each other in Thirukovalur, the lord Narayana could not resist himself but to offer his presence in front of the Aazhvars. Likewise, our swamy attending/responding our question itself is a great joy for us.
Itharkaka, Adiyen Aazhvargalai othu irupathaga solvatha, thavaraga enna vendam. Swami has told, Aazhvar peyar karanam – ‘bakti’ yil aazhvargal. Adiyen ‘samsarathil’ aazhnthu ullen. So the discussion is only an attempt to develop love for achaaryan / Sri Krishna bhagavan thiruvadigal. Adiyen’s humble opinion that the rules and guidelines are very essential in the pursuit of reaching the lord with no doubt but it is OK to make few mistakes (especially when it is not intended) for we are only kids in the lap of the lord.
Request bhaktha to ignore all typos. There is no way to edit in this forum.
Velukkudi Swamy is my Swami
As usual my Swamy will forgive my mistakes.
Also adiyen’s intention was to give higher respect so used that word.
Ippa vishayam is
“Swamin” is used to address those who are younger to us by age or by Spiritual knowledge.
If that’s the case, how in Raghuveera Gadhyam alias Mahaaveera Vaibhavam authored by Sri Swami Desikan recited by my Asmad Acharyan Sri Rangaramanuja Mahadesikan stressed at this point has these words for SriRam?
75.Swamin , jaya, jaya
My Lord victory, victory
76.Raghava Simha, jaya , jaya
Oh Raghava the lion, victory, victory
Uthara Khanda
@Vikram Swami – Adiyen was about to share a thought on swami’s response, but swami has already responded to the devotees of this thread. As swami would very well know, accepting everyone as ‘swami’ is for our own benefit 🙂 Adiyen humbly requests swami to practice the same. In ISKCON, every devotee addresses other male devotee as ‘Prabhu’ (swami) and female devotee as ‘Mataji’
@KongilPiratti Mataji – Please forgive Adiyen if in anyway the response was inappropriate. Adiyen was trying to convey that the ‘semantic’ is important than ‘syntax’. Adiyen in fact was thinking why shouldn’t someone correct ‘syntax’, as much as ‘semantic’ is important to Adiyen, to other devotee, ‘syntax’ may be important. Adiyen feels, perhaps there are more chances that the recipient may feel ‘squeezed’ when such corrections are made to ‘that’ level of granularity. Of course, it only reflects that the ‘tolerance’ level is low but since Adiyen (like devotees) is only a beginner practicing Sadhana, it would be difficult to absorb such feedback. Nevertheless, please forgive Adiyen for having such low level of patience.
Adiyen was wondering, why would the GunaMeter show such high % Sathvik value, though the Tamasik & Rajasik values cannot be elimnated since adiyen is still in this PanchaBootha Prakriti Shareeram (Perishable body). Adiyen thought the high % Stahvik reading is due to some malfunctioning of the GunaMeter. Then, adiyen thought, let me validate if GunaMeter is reading correct or not. Inorder to Validate, adiyen KEPT ASIDE Swami’s Enpani audios/all discourses references and then adiyen started thinking my own answers. Then adiyen noticed the GunaMeter reading as follows:
Then, immdeditely, adiyen started browsing through Swami’s pravachanam audios again and started writing answer, then the Gunameter started reading the same values as type A), which clearly illustrates that the GunaMeter reading B) of high % Tamasik guna is nothing but adiyen immeresed in “Agyanam (Ignorance)”.
Thus, adiyen was able to confirm that adiyen’s “GunaMeter” is reading correct and doesn’t require any further calibration.
So, adiyen’s started KEEPING ASIDE adiyen own thought process and started referring to SWAMI’s PRAVACHANMS again, which provided more satisfaction since GunaMeter reads type A) values.
Hence, adiyen will keep referring/sharing Swami’s Pravachanams before jumping into my own answers.
When adiyen said as “typo error”, it is clearly understood that it is “Unintentional error”, but needs to spell checked for future situations. Adiyen faced a similar situation when adiyen expressed as “Swamin” to one of an elder Baktha, and another Baktha reflexed immedietly using strong words to call the 1st Baktha as “Swami” and explained the differences to adiyen, though adiyen don’t have reference.
We all understand that each one of us (75,000 people or more) in this forum or Enpani members or members of the Trust, all are here because of Swami’s “Causless Mercy/Blessings”. So, Swami will not pay attention to such things since HIS level of Gyanam, Karunai is exemplary.
But, adiyen didnot want another Baktha to face similar situation as adiyen faced, so wanted to pass the message in such a way as “typo error”, so the Baktha can understand what adiyen is trying to tell.
Adiyen is not a learned Scholar to dissect the Sanskrit word “Swamin” from the stotras as mentioned.
When there is a known ACTUAL answer in Enpani #568 “Was Rama King or a Husband First” as said by Swami, we cannot search for an unkown answer to satisfy ourselves.
BhagavAn avatar as SriRama and SriLakshmi Piratti avatar as Sita (DIVYA DAMPADHIS) is to show us the relationship between a Jeevathama and the ParamAthama (not to show the materialistic husband wife relationship).
So, Sri Lakshim Piratti tried to portray Herself as a “JeevAthma”.
Sita Avatar is to show us three things.
1) Krupai/Irakkam/Mercy to all people “JeevaAthamas”.
2) Parathanthriyam (to be sub-servient to ONLY BhagavAn all the time).
3) Ananyargatvam (No one else to be thought or served except BhagavAn as a PathiVratha Sthree).
The issue arises when we start thinking ourselves in place of Sita and their Husband thinks himself in place of SriRama, then we start confusing ourselves as , “do i need send my wife to forest or why did SriRama send Sita to forest”. The above three as Swami says are the actual reasons of the incidents.
We cannot compare the materialtic husband-wife relationship with Spritual relationship. Since all of us either in male or female bodies are actually Jeevathamas (Wife) and only Purushothaman (Male) is BhagavAn SriRama.
Kalashepam means “Time Pass”. How to time-based is involve on ‘BhagavAt Anubhavam (enjoyment)’ and avoid ‘BhagavAt Vicharam (debate)’. Uttar kaandam leads to Bhagavat Vicharam, so avoided.
Yes, Swami interacting with us makes us remember the kalyana gunam “SOWLABHYAM (‘Easy Access’ of Magnanimous Personality)” of BhagavAn SRIKRISHNA THE SUPREME. Such a great Personality who Rishis after doing tapas couldn’t reach HIM, decended from HIS abode SriVaikuntam and playing with Yadhavas is unimaginable. In the same way, Magnanimous Personality Sri Velukkudi SRIKRISHNA Swami also interacts, enlightens, blesses us and forgives our mistakes by lowering himself with ‘Easy Access’ like SRIKRISHNA. We are very fortunate to be born in the same period as Swami’s avataram.
Please forgive for any errors.
Adiyen Sri Velukkudi Krishna Dasan,
Adiyen Acharya Dasan,
Adiyen Ramanuja Dasan,
Chella Pillai Yathiraja Sampathkumar SriKrishna BhagavAn ki Jai.
One question: How do we address women devotee in Sri sampradayam ? If there isn’t anything specific, Is it OK if Adiyen addresses Bakthai as ‘Mataji’ ?
“But, adiyen did not want another Baktha to face similar situation as adiyen faced”
Dhanyosmi ????
“Adiyen is not a learned Scholar to dissect the Sanskrit word “Swamin” from the stotras as mentioned”
There is a chance of mis understanding. So tomorrow if someone points at deviyar please quote the mentioned Shloka of Sri Srimahaveera Vaibhavam . Swami Desikan will never do a mistake. At least Swamy is there to save me 🙂
????
Sri Rama was more of a King no doubt but
Same Velukkudi Swamy has told follow Rama and listen to Krishna
Actually that EnPaNi audio was for adiyen only in one of the previous question in Dharma sandeha forum.
Adiyen not fully convinced. Adiyen already shared my view in Dharma Sandeha thread for your perusal. As there must have been a needhi visaranai (fair trial?) to whoever it may be as a citizen of the country.
Piratti was also a citizen not just a wife of SriRam right? Sita piraatti already did a Agni pravesham (entering fire). 2nd punishment for no fault of her, is unacceptable in adiyen’s opinion. In fact, if it was Sriram who went to forest for failing to protect her adiyen would have been happy.
Adiyen know, Velukkudi Swamy has told “Perumal is Swathanthran we cannot question him”
But Swamy also told “Still Rama/Perumal did as per dharma only even though he could do as per his own will and beyond questioning”
Adiyen’s apologies to Divya dampathis for this known mistake
Also Velukkudi Swamy gave another brilliant interpretation, that piratti wanted kids to grow under eminent Guru and rishis. This sounded great. To get good teachers we can go to any forest no problem at all.
One more widely accepted interpretation is “everything was pre-planned or pre-determined” for avathaara nokam (intentions)
This problem will be solved if all aspects of Srimad Ramayana (including Uttara Bhaga) was discussed is adiyen’s opinion not just till Pattabhishekam
There is one upanyasam as “Sollamal Solliya Ramayanam” by Sri. U. Ve Kidambi Rajagopalachar Swamy that discusses these intricacies but could not listen fully due to track continuity issues. Adiyen have concerns in some of those reasonings as well.
Any way adiyen’s little brain not seasoned to digest bigger things.
“BhagavAn avatar as SriRama and SriLakshmi Piratti avatar as Sita (DIVYA DAMPADHIS) is to show us the relationship between a Jeevathama and the ParamAthama (not to show the materialistic husband wife relationship).
The issue arises when we start thinking ourselves in place of Sita and their Husband thinks himself in place of SriRama, then we start confusing ourselves as , “do i need send my wife to forest or why did SriRama send Sita to forest”. The above three as Swami says are the actual reasons of the incidents.
If this is the case, the sapthapathi in marriage becomes meaningless. The husband (son in law maapillai) is considered as Vishnu & wife as Sri Mahalakshmi
Same Velukkudi Swamy has told about sapthapathi, Kasi yaathrai, arundhathi, Dhruva natchathram rituals in EnPaNi don’t remember the number but request to refer those
Why should we unnecessarily relate ourselves to Divya dhampathis?
There is a gross misundersting in our SriVaishnava sampradhayam is that materialism has no place in spiritualism. It’s completely wrong in adiyen’s opinion. Materialism should favour spiritualism.
Kammi kaasulayo or freeyavo ashramathula room/idam kudukkanum that’s the primary purpose ok for maintaining an ashramam
Or naamaley idam vaangi bhaagavathaalukku srama parihaaram pandrathukku hethu va irukkanum
Northla free bhojanam south la kaasu indha nilai maaranum
If we listen to Velukkudi Swamy’s upanyasam properly we understand “materialistic life leads to spiritual life”.
When arguing with an Englishman, he asked me “how you type in Internet without investing money?”
He is absolutely right. We cannot fool ourselves by saying money is an evil though Swami Desikan could live without it.
In present day world ” we can’t”. We don’t have that pakkuvam maturity at least adiyen don’t have, to say for sure
To rightly put “Money is required for Sath vishayams and sath karyams” – Ref: Thirumangai Azhwar
My Swamy will agree with adiyen
“Kalashepam means “Time Pass”. How to time-based is involve on ‘BhagavAt Anubhavam (enjoyment)’ and avoid ‘BhagavAt Vicharam (debate)’. Uttar kaandam leads to Bhagavat Vicharam, so avoided.”
Sorry cannot agree adiyen. There cannot be an ithihasa whose one part is anubhavam and another part is vicharam.
The whole Srimad Ramayana is telling something to us
Veda vedye pare pumpsi
jate dasharatAtmajey
Veda prAchedasAdAseeth sAkshAth rAmAyanAthmanA
(Please ignore spelling mistakes)
Velukkudi Swamy’s favourite quote of Shlokam to express Srimad Ramayanam
The entire veda came as Ramayanam.
Ofcourse vicharam is necessary when we cannot be emotional (or not tuned to anubhavam) i.e. we cannot keep crying always.
It doesn’t mean Poorva Ramayana doesn’t have vicharams.
So, this argument does not stand any ground.
“Yes, Swami interacting with us makes us remember the kalyana gunam “SOWLABHYAM (‘Easy Access’ of Magnanimous Personality)” of BhagavAn SRIKRISHNA THE SUPREME. Such a great Personality who Rishis after doing tapas couldn’t reach HIM, decended from HIS abode SriVaikuntam and playing with Yadhavas is unimaginable. In the same way, Magnanimous Personality Sri Velukkudi SRIKRISHNA Swami also interacts, enlightens, blesses us and forgives our mistakes by lowering himself with ‘Easy Access’ like SRIKRISHNA. We are very fortunate to be born in the same period as Swami’s avataram.”
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Fully agree
adiyen experiencing Swamy daily even though Swamy is not around me now in person
Please forgive adiyen for any mistakes
Adiyen know my post is full of mistakes 🙂
The time spent in this forum is the worthy time in our life
Lord Krishna asks to gain spiritual knowledge by approaching a spiritual master and serving him. Since Adiyen (like fallen souls) are not yet ready to approach & serve spiritual master, these forums help to get in touch with other pure devotees and gain the same. But that does not mean, we can ‘debate’ and gain the knowledge. In Adiyen’s opinion, if the debate is not ‘2 way’ it will lead to ‘bhagavata abacharam’.
Bg 4.34— ஆன்மீக குருவை அணுகி உண்மையை அறிய முயற்சி செய். அடக்கத்துடன் அவரிடம் கேள்விகள் கேட்டு அவருக்குத் தொண்டு செய். உண்மையைக் கண்டவர்களான தன்னுணர்வு பெற்ற ஆத்மாக்கள் உனக்கு ஞானத்தை அளிக்க முடியும்.
Bg 4.34— Just try to learn the truth by approaching a spiritual master. Inquire from him submissively and render service unto him. The self-realized souls can impart knowledge unto you because they have seen the truth.
And to the other point as far ‘material’ is concerned: It would be so wrong (Ahankaram) to think that the money is important because that is used to serve pure devotees / bhagavatas.
Rather, Bhagavatas come down to this ‘bad’ place to save the other varnas/asramas so it is for our own benefit that we need to take care of bhagavatas. And there shouldn’t be any pride in serving bhagavatas with the money that grahastas earn.
Adiyen’s apologies if the response sounds ‘strong’. Adiyen is only a ‘mic’ to lord sri krishna & acharyas so the message is not just for the recipient(s) but also for the ‘mic’ itself.
“Mathaji” sounds good to adiyen. Adiyen is also ok calling adiyens present name or ” Hello Jeevathama” or any names appropriate as per Dharma shastras.
One of the ‘BhagavAt Anubhavam’.
When little SriKrishna was stealing ‘vennai (butter)’, HE was caught by a gopika. She asked why your hand is inside the butter pot. SriKrishna said, my calf is missing, so I was searching if the calf is inside the butter pot (What a beautiful lie). Gopika was mesmerized with Little SriKrishna ‘ charm and speech and she totally forgot why she caught little SriKrishna. Then she asked “did you find the calf inside the butter calf”. SriKrishna said, ” no, I couldn’t find the calf in the butter pot. I will come later” and HE ran away with lightning speed.
“Vennai Thirudi Maatikondu, Poi Solli Thappitha SriKrishna BhagavAn ki Jai”.
Dhanyosmi Swami,
ENPaNi 728 Can we debate on God? Avajaananthi maaMudA: in Srimad Bhagavath Gita what an extraordinary explanation. Arumai Arumai. Super adiyen. Thaayar namba Amma dhaney adhan, like lava kusha we are also his kids. They lived happily ever after na yevlo nanna irukkum. Yes there is no point in debating after he accepting us 🙂
Perumal is supreme no doubt about it.
Athar bahischa tat sarvam
VyApya nArAyaNa Sthitha:
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Dasanudasan
Also adiyen if remember correct, Swamy saying “Swamy KoorathAzhwan paused writing SriBashya Grantham during discussion on JeevAthma swathanthran or Parathanthran” it was only after clarification the explanatory continued.
Also Parikshit had questions to Sukha Brahmam in Srimad Bhagavatham ” Was Perumal fair and equal to devas and asuras ? “. He did not simply listen.
It was only after convincing clarification the Srimad Bhagavatham continued.
Mukkur Lakshmi Nrusimmhachsryar Swamy used to say:
“Sukhar madhri kadha sonnavaalum kidaiyAdhu, Parikshit madhri Kadha ketavalum kidaiyAdhu”
So our sampradhayam unlike other religions surely encourages debate on everything.
In this open forum it became evident.
Adiyaargal vaazha aranga nagar vaazha
Sri Manavala Maamuniye innum oru Nootrandirum
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Dasanudssan
