Govindan Narayanan swamy, namaskaram.

Since no one has responded so far, let me share my understanding with the hope that this will bring in more knowledgeable persons to contribute to this thread. Please understand I am not an expert on this topic.

Perumal in Deity form wears upanayanam because that is how He is. He actually wears upanayanam, and therefore He does so in the Arca avataram too. It is not that ‘one pattern is pushed to the peoples’ eye’; He presents Himself as He is. Kindly note, the arca avataram is not merely a representation of convenience. The arca avataram is Himself. So, before prathista when the sculptor is preparing the form, he has to make the form exactly as described in the sastra; then prathista is done. If the sastra describes that He is wears upanayanam, then that is how His form is prepared by the sculptor.

As a side point, in the modern celebrations of Ganesh caturthi, they make representations of Ganesha is so many different variations, many of which are odd and not in accordance with traditioanl descriptions. So, in truth they can not expect Lord Ganesha to manifest in such odd forms.

I would like to mention this too; upanayanam is not limited to only one varna; in the ancient days kshatriyas and vaishyas also received upanayam and were qualified as ‘dwija’. A good example is Krishna Himself! We know He appeared in a kshariya family and was brought up in a vaishya family; it is explicitly stated that He was regular in doing sandhyavandanam, which is one of the duties of a dwija.

However, over time these two varnas have given up this process in most traditions (there are some rare exeptions found even today). Unfortunately,  even among those born in the brahmana family, the upanayanam has come to be merely a ceremony in many families. The spiritual significance and the full potency of the samskara is not realised by many. Because, when we go through the ‘purification’ / ‘qualification’ through the upanayanam samskara but do not engage in the prescribed duties, then the effect of the purification becomes inaccessible to us.

adiyen dasan.

Srimathe Ramanujaya Namaha

Namaskaram “Govindan NarayanAn” Swamy,

To append on Kambandasan Swami’s valid reference “………..He presents Himself as He is. Kindly note, the arca avataram is not merely a representation of convenience. The arca avataram is Himself……….”

With Acharya ThiruvAdi Bhalam and Velukkudi Sri Krishnan Swami’s Aasirvadham, here are some insights.

Though devareer’s question is from devareer’s perspective, we have to look for the reason from BhagavAn’s perspective and HE says “HERE IS MY VIEWPOINT“.

**********************

“I’M HERE TO CATER THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE EACH COMMUNITY PEOPLE. AS SOME COME TO SEE ME TO GET THEIR MATERIAL NEEDS FULLFILLED. SOME COME TO SEE ME TO GET BLESSINGS WITH NO EXPECTATIONS. SOME COME TO SEE ME JUST TO DO SERVICE.

I’M WEARING “YAGNOPAVITHAM” (POONOOL IN YOUR TERMS) TO CATER THE BRAHMAN COMMUNITY WHO IS ONE AMONG MY VEDIC TRADITION, SO THAT THEY CAN FOLLOW THE SAME LOOKING AT ME, IF THEY FORGET TO WEAR AS PER THEIR VARNASHRAMA DHARMAM.

AND,

TO CATER THE NON-VEDIC TRADITION FOLLOWERS, I DON’T WEAR YAGNOPAVITHAM AS IN MY BUDDHA AVATAR. YOU CAN LOOK AT MY ARCHA IDOL FORM IN ANGKOR WAT CAMBODIA TEMPLE.

DOES THIS CLARIFY YOUR MIND MY CHILD

***********************

(ElayaAlwar) Srinivasa (DhoddayAcharyar) Dasan.

Srimate Ramanujaya Namaha

I am not qualified but I say what other Bagavathas said.

Poonal is also a ornament of Sriman Narayana. So he wears it. It’s not pushing. Rather it is also a decoration. Like Lord Sri Krishna wears Makara Kundala

Adiyen

Many thanks for great explanation! I enjoy the beauty of my perumal in all way . Reason why asked this? How an atheist or non-believers see our perumal and promote wrong view. Hence asked. Now I have very good explanations

I can see this explanation and main motive mentioned as for better health for Brahmins the YAGNOPAVITHAM
is must : https://trsiyengar.com/yagnjopaveetham-poonal-sacred-thread/ why we need to highlight Yagnopavitham for Perumal vigraham in most of the Divya Desam. ? Suyambu moorthi also comes up in this form ?. I don’t have any issues. But why to insist the particular formation?.

Namaskaram Govindan Swamy

Swami Devareer’s statement

“Perumal itself is our enjoyment not his style of representaion”

Swami there is something very deep in this

Who is enjoying who
Who is being represented as what

Perumal is enjoying (rather experiencing)
Perumalself using Peruman’s shareram ( jeevatma)

Perumal is being represented as Consciousness through his shareram ( jeevatma)

Now let’s say Devareer is standing before SRINIVASA PERUMAL IN TIRUMALA

ask yourself what is happening there

Answer will be nothing from Devareer’s point
But there is Experience for Perumal

And also the other question is whether Devareer is seeing ARCA OF SRINIVASA PERUMAL or the ARCA OF SRINIVASA PERUMAL IS BEING PROJECTED THROUGH DEVAREER

to say in simple words

Is there a subject and object or only subject with object as a projection from the subject

Devareer statement has the answers

The answer should be the second option
Only subject with object as the projection of the subject

Subject is Peruman object is ARCA OF SRINIVASA PERUMAL and this proves ARCA AS AN AVATAR BECAUSE IT IS PROJECTED FROM THE SUBJECT (PERUMAN) THROUGH HIS SHARERAM ( JEEVATMA)

“QUALIFIED MONOISM”

Thank you very much Swamy – Peruman is acting through Devareer to answer adiyen question

Devareer’s real question about ponnal is just a sakku

adiyen

Ajan becomes Dwijan
😁